Episode 115: Stephanie Hayes

Stephanie Hayes

Intro: [00:00:00] Welcome to the pretty powerful podcast. Where powerful women are interviewed every week to share real inspiring stories and incredible insight to help women or anyone break the barriers, be a part of innovation, shatter the glass ceiling, and dominate to the top of their sport industry, or life's mission.

Join us as we celebrate exceptional women and step into our power. And now here's your host, Angela Gennari.

Angela Gennari: Hello and welcome to another episode of the Pretty Powerful podcast. My name is Angela Gennari, and today I'm here with Stephanie Hayes. Hi, Stephanie. Hi, how are you? I am wonderful. So Stephanie is a business strategist for established business owners who have built a viable, profitable business, yet feel stagnant, uninspired, and maybe even a little directionless.

Her clients are looking for ways to build wealth rather than just income and get their business working harder for them and [00:01:00] ultimately position themselves for a successful. This is a new topic and I can't wait to dive into this with you.

Stephanie Hayes: Awesome. Me too.

Angela Gennari: So tell me what made you want to get into the business exit strategy kind of side?

Stephanie Hayes: Well, it was something that sort of evolved for me over time. And, um, you know, I, uh, I'm a serial entrepreneur myself. I have started up several businesses. I think you and I actually have a fairly similar backstory. I grew up in a. An industry that was very male dominated, very technology industry. I own a software company, I've owned consulting companies, I have, um, built several different businesses and I kind of went out on my own as, um, just working with small business owners about 10 years ago and I, you know, I loved it and it was, um.

It was super fun, and I had a lot of great clients, but what I was sort of feeling over time was that I really wanted a deeper focus, um, [00:02:00] and, uh, you know, I'm a, I focus on business model design, organizational design at the corporate level, and, you know, that kind of thing, but that's, it's not, it's not necessarily something that I love it.

Business owners are sitting around going, geez, I think I need to update my business model. What they don't realize is that's what could solve a lot of their problems. But they're often thinking I have a marketing problem. I have to figure out how to, you know, do another marketing strategy or something like that.

And I think this all sort of culminated, um, a few years ago. I was actually down in, um, South Padre Island with a client and we were doing a bit of a, like an offsite for a few days. And we decided to take one of the days and really look at our own businesses.

Both: And we

Stephanie Hayes: had this big wall of like notes and post notes in front of me and I was looking at it just thinking, done all this stuff, but I don't feel like I'm really building something.

Right. I don't feel like I'm working towards something. And at the time, you know, I had been through a divorce and lost all of my assets and my house and you know, in this market, I live up in a very, very [00:03:00] expensive part of the world. To think about getting into real estate again was really daunting and I don't know that I ever will.

And so I thought, what can I build in my life that gives me the same kind of asset I would get with real estate and, you know, kind of work towards something, build something. And I started thinking, why am I not buying, renovating and selling businesses?

Both: And

Stephanie Hayes: that became a real like focus for me and a real goal because I could take the skills that I had and all the things that I knew.

And be able to translate that into, you know, buying businesses, renovating them, selling them for profit, same way you might flip real estate. So then it got me thinking, okay, but on the other side of things, people who are building businesses. Can sell their businesses. And it opened me up to this whole market, right?

There are marketplaces for selling every different type of business. And it occurred to me that all of these business owners I was working with have a lot of value inside their business that they don't realize, and they'll get to a point [00:04:00] where they get really sort of burnt out and they think, oh, well.

What am I going to do in the future? I guess I, I guess when I'm finished working, I just, there goes my business. Like I just shut it down. And that's what often happens, but I'm trying to educate business owners to make them realize that a, there's a lot of value inside their business already.

Both: And

Stephanie Hayes: B they can focus on building value inside their business rather than just more income.

And that's been a really like transformational thought for a lot of people. And a lot of the folks that I'm working with. And I started thinking about how do I, how do I communicate the idea of an exit? And then that evolved into if I actually look at my business from The concept of valuation, even if I never intend to exit my business or sell my business ever, if I start looking at it from the perspective of valuation, it really starts to synthesize for me where I should be spending my time and where those opportunities are for growth.

Because when you do valuation, you [00:05:00] also do risk assessment and those risks are the places that are opportunities.

Both: So it's been a

Stephanie Hayes: really interesting conversation and the folks that I'm working with, we're not looking at their business and say, okay, we, we want it. Sell it in six months. We're saying, if in five years you want to sell it, what would you do now to increase the value of your business and increase the assets in your business and stop focusing just on chasing income.

So that's been sort of the evolution and it's really like kind of blown up and it's been really resonant with all of the folks that I talk to and the people in my connections and my network and with my clients. And that's what, where the focus has really started to evolve.

Angela Gennari: Love it so much. So that's brilliant because I've actually started thinking that way a lot myself lately because you know My my previous businesses when I was done with them I was just done and I just walked away and there was no exit.

There was no exit other than like Okay. I'll just shut it down. Like, you know, my very first business, it was, um, [00:06:00] you know, it was an accidental business. I was, I did not have a business background. I have a psychology background. I started this business to solve a problem that I had, which was, you know, meeting young professionals.

So I started this like young professionals networking group, which turned into an event management company, which turned into retreats and all these other things. And then when I got married and moved to Tampa, I was like, eh, I'll just shut it down. You know, like I just closed it. Like it was just, it was just not existing anymore.

And so the sad thing about that is that I had people reach out to me and say, Hey, can I buy your mailing list? Cause I had a mailing list of like 2000 people who would come to our events. And I was like, no, I'm not going to sell their personal information. Like that, that would be wrong. That was so valuable.

Like, what was I thinking like this? And so, yeah, like it. I just, you know, I had a brand, I had a reputation, all these things were good, like I could have sold the business and I just didn't know that that was an option. And then I, and then, and then I get married and, [00:07:00] and then I have a business for 10 years with my, you know, now ex husband.

So when we were together, we were married for 10 years and I had my business and it was successful and we did well. And, you know, when we were getting a divorce, my focus was on, you know, where is this going to go? Where's that going to go? And, oh, by the way, we shouldn't work together anymore because that would be weird.

And so even though it was 51 percent owner, I just had him buy me out of like one contract. Like it was like, It was the worst deal for me, you know, and best deal on the planet for him. But like, again, you know, I just looked at it as, okay, it's just time to leave. And I just left. And that was just. Wrong in every way.

And so now this is going to be the 10th anniversary of my current business. And while I, you know, it's not on my mind, like sell, sell, sell. I also know that I am the primary person in the business and I need to have an exit strategy. And I'm just finally learning that you need to have an exit [00:08:00] strategy on day one of your business.

Not because you intend to sell it, but because if anything were to happen, you need to know. What happens next, right? Like it's the, it's, it's the, if I get hit by a bus clause, right?

Stephanie Hayes: I'm so happy to hear that because when we, when in the program that I'm building, um, called assets to exits,

Both: that's,

Stephanie Hayes: um, it started out with just wanting to make the focus on, um, What happens when you exit or how do you build an exit strategy?

And, and I always had the perspective of not for tomorrow, but for five, 10 years down the road, three to five, whatever that feels like for you. And whether your exit is, I'm going to sell my business or I'm going to just take myself out of the business and retain ownership. There's like multiple ways that you can exit.

Like having that perspective is so important. And what's it's evolved to is there's actually what I call sort of an entrepreneurial exit journey. Right. And right from the beginning, even at the very, very beginning for you is like, I'm just starting out. There's still, [00:09:00] there are still things that you should be doing to think about what that ultimate plan really is going to be.

And therefore the growth and the development of your business starts to change and becomes a lot more focused. So I built this sort of like exit. Roadmap right like this journey for it and that starts with that very very and people sort of find themselves on that road map Like kind of where are you here?

and what are the things that you should be focusing on when on whatever stage of growth you are or like a maturation of your business and then when we get down to the sort of end of the road map where you're like thinking seriously about Then we start talking about what does the next road map look like for you?

And what do we? I'm going prepare for that, but you know, those people who have it as sort of like a twinkle in their eye, you know, three to five years down the road. Okay, well, let's do a benchmark valuation right now. Let's look at that and let's figure out where the places that I can actually, and you have one client right now that I'm working with who has a super.

Great little business, right? Like she's [00:10:00] selling it right now. She could get money for it. But, um, when we did, when we did the valuation and we looked at what, how those numbers would change if she, you know, diversified her income channels or she, you know, had another strategy over here or whatever, it almost like more than doubled her valuation.

So she could be looking 1, 000, 000, you know, and so she's like, this is worth it. Let's do this, right? So we're doing this before she has to sell. We're doing this three to five years in advance so that it can gain traction and she can have the best exit when she actually gets there. And so I think a lot of people don't think that way.

They kind of may think, Oh, what's my long, I think I have this sort of twinkle in my eye, but if you actually do now. You end up exiting your business with it and, you know, I'll work with her when she ultimately gets to an exit and we will put together her offer and her memorandum and like we'll negotiate and all that sort of thing too, but right now the order of the day is find all the places where we can increase that opportunity.[00:11:00]

Angela Gennari: And I love that you were talking about that because it's true. An exit doesn't have to be tomorrow, right? Like, it's not like, okay, I need to sell my business. You start thinking about the exit well ahead of time and you even start thinking about the exit, even if you just want to make changes in your business.

Cause like you were saying, there's, there's so much that can be done. Like for me, what I've noticed is that I maxed out on time. Right. And so for me, I started looking at how can I maximize my time? And I'm only one person, but I'm the, I'm the only owner of the company. But if I wanted to bring in an investor and I wanted to bring in more money, I wanted to bring in executives who want ownership.

I need to be able to, to separate out what makes sense. And so removing myself, I have too many roles in the business right now. And it's, it's come, it's become very evident because I am experiencing burnout. And so because I have too many roles in my own business, I'm thinking exit strategy, not because I want to sell, but because I want to bring in other executives.

I want to delegate [00:12:00] tasks that are, are needed. I don't need to be doing. And so in order to do that, I need to start thinking like, how do I remove myself from the business? Not because I want to quit, but because. I want to be able to be efficient, right? And so it's, a lot of it comes down to efficiency. I just finished reading the book built to sell, which I'm sure you're familiar.

Um, love the book. I think it's amazing, but it taught me so much. And just like what you were saying, the time to do it is not right when you're ready to sell. It's years before it's, you know, even in built to sell, he says, I need two years. You know? I can get you to a sale, but I need two years to do that.

And so entrepreneurs should not be thinking like, okay, I'm going to sell my business in the next three months. Let me start, go get evaluation. It should be. I want to sell my business in the next five years. Let me figure out how to get the maximum amount I can from that. And that's not something I think we're ever taught as entrepreneurs.

Stephanie Hayes: And that's why the conversation resonates so [00:13:00] much with all the folks that I speak to. And these are typically like solo entrepreneurs or they're expert businesses. You know, they're in their sort of early seven figures, late six figures, even like maybe halfway through that range. That's sort of the sweet spot for me because nobody's talking to them.

And if you want to sell your business and you've got three months to sell. That's a last, that's too late to make those changes and have any sort of effects, right? So let's do that now. There's another really great book called, um, buy then build. And so that's all around acquisition entrepreneurship and it's coming from the perspective of the buyer, but it actually really gives you, um, a sense as to what, as a seller, you kind of want to.

Build inside your business. If you, if you do want to sell, but you know, going back to what you were saying, I mean, that, that is just, it's bang on in terms of all the folks that I'm working with, that they're, you know, they're, they're looking at their businesses, they're like, I don't know how to go from here to there because I'm so in my business.

I'm playing all the roles. All the things. So the work I [00:14:00] do with them right now is putting in kind of an operating system right where they're they're where we're taking I'm abstracting them out of the day to day of their business and putting a team in place that actually works for them and. Takes away all of that and they're just going, Oh, because now they can focus on the things that, you know, are truly what they need to do to build that business forward and make that business really work.

And yet they get stuck in all of these day to day operating decisions and, and what have you. So there's two parts of this. There's the having the, having the longterm focus or having that exit focus, but also turning yourself into a leader that leads as opposed to. a leader that manages. And so the sort of the phrase that I use is, um, create with purpose and lead with power.

And when I talk about power, I mean, power comes from being completely in alignment with the work that you're doing. Not, you know, how, [00:15:00] you know, is this, has this email gone out and do I have all of the right systems in place? Like all of that sort of thing. So those people who have decided and understood that that's the key, like that's the formula.

They're investing now and they stepping into this and they're saying, okay, I'm making the investment now to put this piece in place, by the way, putting that operating system in place makes your business more valuable, makes it more scalable, more valuable to a buyer. And also whether your exit is an operational exit where you just take yourself out of the business or if your exit is a sell.

It benefits both.

Angela Gennari: Yeah. Yeah.

Stephanie Hayes: That's the sort of the leading kind of rally cry is the create with purpose. You know, I know where I'm going. I'm making every decision with a purpose and lead with power. My own power power doesn't have to mean, you know, male bro. I'm dominant. It means that I'm powerful because I'm leading from a place that is really aligned with who I am.

So those two things. Yeah. You know, work really [00:16:00] nicely together and they have to work together. You can't just build an exit strategy and not know how you're going to get there. You can't build an exit strategy and not turn into a leader. Yes, you'll never get there. Right.

Angela Gennari: Well, and I like that you say create with purpose because it really starts with that foundation of like, what am I doing?

And why am I doing it? Right. Because nobody cares what you do. And so they know why you do it. Right. So having that Purpose from the very beginning allows you to scale because you have a foundation and you can't I always say you can't build a sandcastle or you can't build a real castle on sand, right?

You can build a sandcastle. It gets washed away by the water. But if you want to build a home, you don't do it on sand, right? You go to the foundation. And so you can't build on something that's not stable. And so until you get your why until you get that foundation, your career creation, you know that.

This is why I'm doing what I'm doing, and then you build upon that, and that allows you to scale. You can't develop foundation, you can't develop your foundation midway through your building.

Stephanie Hayes: When we talk about [00:17:00] purpose, um, and we talk about why people want to exit, it, there, it's, it's always different, right?

It's, it's very rarely just about the money, though, that's great. You know, I optimize that, but it's, you know, when, when you finally exited and you finally left your business. Like we do a lot of post exit planning too, because you got to know what that's going to look like too, because you can end up in this hole of like, you know, this disastrous sort of spiral of, I don't know who I am

Angela Gennari: anymore because I've been depressed.

Depression, you know, because we, you know, we talk about this in one of the entrepreneur groups I belong to that, like, you know, for the first year after your business, don't do anything like, because you'll make bad choices because you're in desperate, like, I need to fill my time. I need to use this money.

I need to, you know, spend this. I need to invest this. This and sometimes we make the worst decisions right after we sell, because all of a sudden there's a windfall. There's all this time and all this money. What do we do with it? So,

Stephanie Hayes: you know what, I would actually really love to be in a position of doing [00:18:00] nothing for a year.

Like, yeah, yeah, exactly. Sounds amazing, but it's choice. Right. And a lot of people talk about freedom. And in fact, my big program is called build freedom, but I, you know, people talk about freedom, but what they really want is choice and they really want to be able to, um, Be able to determine what they're choosing to do.

Right. So I sort of make that distinction, but freedom is freedom to like freedom is a huge part of all of it. Right. Freedom is a huge part of, um, being free of the things that encumber me being free of the decisions. I don't want to have to make just me. Into this role with, uh, with, um, one of my clients right now.

And it's been really, really interesting because we are literally this week in transition where she is stepping out of this operational role that she's had in her business. And she stepped forward and she said, this is who I want to be. And. Um, I, I'm, I'm [00:19:00] so excited by it, but at the same time, like, it's like cutting the, the cord, right?

Cutting the ties of all these decisions that I've had to make. And it's just a new way of living. And she's really excited about it, but it's also like a hard transition, right?

Both: Yeah.

Stephanie Hayes: So all of this stuff is sort of, but nobody's talking about this. You know, you go talk about exits. You get a lot of bros who are just kind of like, yeah, evaluation.

Unless they're looking at, you know, multiple seven figures. So I really want to serve this, like this. these, these purpose built businesses, these expert businesses, these solo entrepreneurs, these small business owners who are just kind of going, I don't know what's there for me. I don't know. And they all have assets inside their business already.

They all, and there's. I'll give you a link to the nine types of assets you can build inside your business. But a lot of people are like, Oh, I don't have it. Yes, you do. You know, you've got these nine different things that you can look for inside your business. And the people who are in my group program, you know, it's, they've been indoctrinated with all they're my lifers, right?

They've been in dark. And so they start thinking this way [00:20:00] and they start making, even if they're never going to sell their business, they're building their business with the intention of building assets, things that have long term value, things that become. Um, and it's so cool to watch, like if I can make that impact with people and give them something that's much more, you know, feels much better for them, I think that that's so worth it.

Angela Gennari: Yeah. I love it. So, I mean, and I think that what you're doing, you know, giving them a holistic view of what is, you know, what do you do now to sell in five years? What do you do when you sell, you know, with the valuation and all of that. And then what do you do after, like, that is, that is so critical because so many of these M& A companies, they're only focused on the sell.

You know, now. Right. They're not focused on helping you grow. They're not helping you, you know, build assets. They're not telling you how to, you know, how to take this, you know, and there's so much, like the other thing that, you know, people don't think about is sometimes when you're an entrepreneur and a serial entrepreneur that you're not the best one to run your business at the end of the day.

Right. Because you're, you're in like with me, [00:21:00] I like to build the business. I like to get into that mode of like, go, go, go, go. And then when the business is running, I'm like, Huh. How can I complicate this? How can I make this, you know, and so like, I, I keep kind of joking that I've been running my business as a startup for 10 years because that's the way I know how to do it.

Right. And so like, every year, we're going to reinvent ourselves. And I'm like, they're like, again,

Stephanie Hayes: but that's such a good point because people there really is a life cycle. And I think people feel really happy. Yeah. almost shameful if they get to the point in their business where they're like, I'm just not here anymore.

And I, but I, I should be the one who takes it to this million dollar exit. Shouldn't I? And I'm like, no, it's okay. I bought a business last, you know, in 2023, because I want to eat my own dog food, right? Like I want to be on the buy side as well. And that was something that was my long term plan was to start buying.

I've bought 500 businesses. I've bought 180, 000 businesses. So I bought one in 2023. And, um, the, the, the owner, [00:22:00] I actually helped design the business. So it was like, I was very familiar with it, but the owner was my ex client and we'd known each other for a long time and we'd worked together for a long time.

And she had gotten to the point in her business where she was just like. I'm done. Like, I, I just, like, I cannot bring myself to want to do any more with this business. I'm like, that's okay. Right?

Angela Gennari: Yeah.

Stephanie Hayes: That's okay. I'd rather take this business from you and give it a chance to survive and thrive. Then, you know, see it go down the tubes with all of the assets that you've built inside of it.

So there is a life cycle. There is a life cycle for you inside the business. And you have to know yourself as a business owner and what kind of works for you on the same way you get into that mundane. And I'm just like, that's death for me. Right. And like, so maybe you build a business model where you are creating all the time, or you're creating, you have some way to create and to, you know, to innovate inside the business and then that will satisfy you.

So I think. This alignment that I do with my [00:23:00] clients, whether they're exiting or they're just building a business model, you always have to come back to them and who they are as business owners and that create, then you build your offers, then you build your pricing, then you build your delivery system, then you build your system, like all of that has to come from understanding yourself, because if you don't do that, you end up building a business that you hate.

Right.

Angela Gennari: Right. Or a business that's so demanding on you and your time that you're not enjoying it anymore. Like you have to love what you do. And as entrepreneurs, you know, we, we have to love our business more than anyone else loves our business. And when we get to the point where we just. Don't like, we need to be able to say it's okay.

It's okay. Give it to somebody who will, you know, like this is the time to turn it over. And like, I love the startup phase. I love this part, but I, you know, we're 10 years in and I'm like, okay, I am at the max of what I know. Right. And so now there is that need to bring other people in and I'm not saying I want to exit.

I'm just saying. [00:24:00] I want to make room at the top for somebody else to come in and help me run this because I've reached the pinnacle of what I can contribute meaningfully, and I need somebody to take it to the next level.

Stephanie Hayes: Yeah, and that's, that's exactly where I end up coming in with my clients and they're just like, I don't know what the answer is right now.

It's so easy for me to see you, like I come in and I'm like, okay, you know, your value is over here. So let's just like get you focused, lead with power, right? Get, get you focused on just that. And then let me abstract the rest of that and build a team around. What or maybe we let parts of the business go right like let maybe there's things that just aren't don't make sense and aren't serving so from a strategic perspective that's exactly the the function that I provide for my clients is being able to come in as I call myself like a shadow CEO like I can.

My superpower is that I can exist and think at this very strategic level and I could, I've got so much experience with, you know, building and running [00:25:00] businesses and seeing all the staff that I can help them figure out what that exit strategy is, what that long term strategy is, and be the custodian of that, but at the same time, be able to be You know, get their operations in place, get the rest of their business in place, lead.

I know every little nitty gritty part of business. I, I know how to lead a team. So I do the things that they don't want to do as a CEO. And I operate like a CEO in partnership with them. And then we build that piece of the business over 12 months so that. I can step out and they can stay where they are and this stuff just kind of continues to build and grow.

But we make lots of decisions. Is this part of the business? Does this still make sense? What does this need to evolve into? If you want to be out. What does the rest of the business need to look like? What are the resources that you need? Like, there's all that's possible. But I find people just get stuck sort of sitting there going, I don't know what to do.

Right?

Angela Gennari: Yeah. Yeah. Well, and I love the [00:26:00] space that you're in because you're in that. That really beautiful spot where most of the entrepreneurs that you're working with, these CEOs, they're, they're in it because of a passion and a talent that they have, you know, whether it's, I own a bakery because I love to bake, or I'm a plumber or I'm an electrician, or I'm a chef and I own a restaurant, like you are in it with the people who started out of passion for what they do really, really exceptionally well, but those people Gennarierally don't have a business.

Background right and so this is where it becomes really challenging like you can have a really successful small business as a solopreneur or as a you know as a passion small business passions you know foundation small business but. Not have that business background and know how to scale, know how to market, know how to, you know, bring on investors, know how to expand, know how to get licensing in other states, know how to franchise.

And this is where that business expertise can come in [00:27:00] and say, look, I think you've built a really, really solid business. Let's figure out how to 10 X this business, right? Because that's not in their wheelhouse. Their wheelhouse got them to where they are and they might be very successful at it, but they're stuck.

Because now they're like, okay, whatever happens beyond this, I don't know how to make that work.

Stephanie Hayes: A hundred percent. And you know what? You should be the expert. You should be leaning into what you do best and where your power really is lead with power and, um, you know, let the rest of it when you're at that stage, right?

Like early, early on, you're going to do everything. And I argue that maybe you should, because you get the experience. I happen to have done everything, and I can tell you, I can sit down and I can code, I can sit down and I can design, I can sit down and I know, you know, I know the clothing industry, I know the, the cannabis industry, like I've had this wonderful experience of being able to be in every part of every business and every part of every, you know, it's just I'm curious and I like to learn [00:28:00] things.

So, you know, that puts me in a really good position to be able to come in and say, okay. Great. So let's, what's your unique, and I think people try to force themselves into these, these frameworks or these, like what worked for someone else. And then they, they get frustrated. I see this over and over again.

I was at an event in Florida in December, and you know, a lady was sitting with me for a long time. And she said, I've spent the last three or four years just buying everyone else's solutions to my, to my business. What I really need to do is just hire you because it doesn't work to. Um, to try and shoehorn myself into, you know, some other framework, like I need someone to look at me and who I am and my little business and what's unique about that and figure out what I'm doing going forward.

And I'm like, yeah, it's true, right? It's totally true. There's a lot of value into being able to productize something and to be able to give people guidance. But I would argue those things work better when you're sort of early days. But once this business becomes an entity of its own and has its own [00:29:00] personality and its own, then you really have to.

Think through what's going to be most aligned for you, for your business, for your industry, for your little specific area that you've gotten to. And, you know, there's really great book. Um, initially when I heard the title, I was like, ah, that's not something I want to read as a bro book or whatever, but actually.

Um, it's 10x is easier than 2x. Oh my god, I

Angela Gennari: literally recommended that to somebody today. Did

Stephanie Hayes: you? Oh, yeah. So, I would say, like, 60 to 70 percent of the book, like, it's kind of like, okay, great, I got the concept.

Both: But

Stephanie Hayes: when you do get the concept and you, and you start to really think about it, it makes so much sense.

Yeah. Because if I think about all the things That I would have to do if I was running my business at 10 times what I was making, it would be very, very different than what I kill myself worrying about right now. And you know, I'm thinking like, I'm thinking about what my social media posts. That's not what I, [00:30:00] I'm going to worry about a 10, 10 times, like, what does 10 times this business look like?

Right. And then you start just chopping stuff off of your, your plate because you're like, this doesn't matter.

Angela Gennari: Yeah. Yeah. Or delegate it, delegate it, hire it out, outsource it, like, you know, focus on your sweet spot and what you do exceptionally well, and then double down on that. And that's what I like about the book because I've always been in the mindset of work harder, work harder, work harder.

I need to double my income. I need to work twice as much. I need to do this. And the book just basically lays it out. You can't 10 X your time and effort because you're already probably at max. Right. And so if you want a 10 X, you literally can't, you literally cannot. So the only thing you can do is start taking away and you start taking away all those things that are not adding value and are not adding.

Any substance to what you do on a regular basis, and so get really, really defined on your sweet spot and go all in on that.

Stephanie Hayes: Totally. And it really does work. And it really is [00:31:00] a sort of a big game changer, but I do think we need. You know, thought partners to sit with us and, and be able to think through what that might look like for our business.

Cause we get so stuck in like what we've, you know, immersed ourselves in and what we've learned about our business. And we, we get so committed to those narratives that it's hard for us to see that there's something else that could be totally game changing. Like I did this with my, the business I bought, right.

I really look at this as like my sandbox, right? This was my, this was my little first. you know, proper purchase of a business. I bought a bunch of these little businesses because, you know, there's a whole other strategy around, you know, some guy in, I don't know, overseas in Pakistan has built this, this domain up to the point where it's got reasonable amount of traffic and he's going to sell it for 500 bucks and you buy it for 500 bucks and you renovate it and you start putting all the strategies in place to sell it to Somebody for 5, 000 and then they're going to take it and they're going to sell it to 15, [00:32:00] 000 and so on and so forth, right?

So it's such an interesting little economy, but this was my first sort of real purchase of a business and I wanted to get that experience and I'm somebody who doesn't live in a lot of fear. So for me to go and do that was just kind of like, alright, let's see, you know, I learned by doing so. But I really applied that concept to this business and it completely changed what we were spending all our time and resources on.

And it really felt liberating because I could see the bigger strategy, I could see the things that we needed to invest in, and everything that didn't sort of suit that, I just cut. And I was like, this is great, right? Yeah. Because Those little busy things. Mm-hmm . Weren't actually contributing. They weren't, they weren't moving us forward.

They weren't like, I'm a big data tracker. Like I come from the tech industry. I, I'm a nerd. Right. And so I always wanna know what my data is. I always wanna know what my analytics are. [00:33:00] So if I can't, if I can't equate some strategy, some tactic to like a, a, like a reasonable impact on the business, we're cutting it.

Like, we're just not going to do it, right? I need to know for sure. But once I know, it's out, right? Yeah. So, that's been a really interesting exercise. Like, I would never sit in front of you and say, Oh, it's been so successful, Angela. Like, I've had, I've just like, I've launched it into the stratosphere. No, we, it was a hard year.

It was a hard year. It really sucked. I really needed to learn someone else's And I had to unravel a lot of stuff that nobody had any information on. So, you know, good lessons, right? Like, was it the right purchase for me? We'll see. But I plan this year on changing it into an entirely new business. And that took me a year of getting in there.

Like Walker Diables book, um, Biden build, right. It love it. He was, he's so good. I'm in his community, everything like that, [00:34:00] but he's like, just. Just live the business for a little while like just go and live it for a little while and in some ways you kind of have to do the same thing in your own business like you have to go in there and live it for a little while and in a different perspective and maybe then you're going to start to see what this business could look like.

But that's a hard thing for someone who's been in it 5 10 years who also doesn't have a business background.

Angela Gennari: Yeah. Yeah. Well, and you know, when you're coming into somebody else's business, sometimes you just don't know what you're going to uncover, right? There could be some business dealings that you would not have made and some contracts you could not, you would not have gone into.

Um, there were a couple of years ago. I. We need, we wanted to expand a couple of years ago. And at first my thought was, well, let's just acquire other companies. Cause that's what everybody does in my industry, all the security companies, you just go buy smaller companies than you. And, uh, so I hired an M and a company and I said, Hey, go find us some security companies out of state that we can purchase.

And, um. You know, the M& A company, obviously they [00:35:00] only make money when they actually acquire something. And so, you know, I, I had them out there looking and, you know, thankfully they were very honest and they came back and they were like, Angela, the problem is you don't want these companies. Like you don't want them like they're the contracts are not good.

Um, you know, they've lowballed contracts to increase their valuation. You know, you don't want their employees. You don't want their business processes. Like you'd come in there and eat their lunch. Why don't you just go in and compete with them? Like just go organically, start a company and compete with them and you'll get all the same business.

And so it saved me a lot. You know, obviously I didn't buy any of these companies, but. Sometimes what you're buying isn't necessarily what you, what, what was on paper, you know, you're, you're going to find, you're always going to uncover some things. It's going to be a culture shift. It's going to be a lot, but the opportunity, if you can go in there and do something great with a business, even with the brand and then flip it is Gennariius.

And right now, I mean, with all [00:36:00] the, the boomers retiring and wanting to sell their business, it's a really exceptionally good time to do that.

Stephanie Hayes: There are so many of these little, you're totally right, there are so many of these little like, industries, like bookkeeping, or um, you know, like notaries, or anything like that.

Where you could just acquire a pile of them and you can put a team in place with those sort of transferable skills. And you can have a great, I mean, you're acquiring a book of business, right? When I built, when I bought this business, that's essentially at the end of the day, all I was, I acquired the assets of the business.

And all I was acquiring was a list. And as it turns out, that list is kind of dead. But did I know that? No, I had no way of knowing that. But this is the gamble that you make and I was willing to make it. But You have to be really clear on what you're buying, right? And are you buying a book of business?

And is this a skill that I could just put a team in place to transfer over? Yeah, there's a real opportunity there. I don't know if you ever followed Cody Sanchez, but she's got [00:37:00] like, she's, she just launched, um, Main Street Millionaire and she, her whole shtick is about going and buying boring businesses, laundromats and, you know, like vending machine businesses and stuff like that.

There's a lot of money to be made in, in those, if you can find and innovate on the business model. So there's, you know. The whole thing eats my brain, right? Like this whole buy then build acquisition entrepreneurship. But if you look at it from the other perspective, if you learn about it from the perspective of the buyer and that's what I wanted to do, I wanted to have both sides, then you can really represent the, the needs of the seller as well.

And you can, and again, like I said, this has to be a long term decision. Don't make that decision, if you're going to make the decision to sell in the short term. You're going to have to sell just what you've got, right? But if you start looking at this from the longer term and you understand the concept of buying and selling and acquisition, and, and then you, you can absolutely put yourself in a really great position.

Angela Gennari: Yeah, for sure. Well, and going [00:38:00] back to your analogy of real estate, sometimes you do the, the fix and flip and you don't know what you're going to get, but you know, with these businesses, a lot of it is just efficiency. Find the efficiency, figure out a better way to do it, you know, because. Usually people will run their business the same way over the lifespan of the business, right?

And so if you come in and you're an outsider looking in, you're like, Hey, I've got this laundromat and this is the way they've always done it. And they're going to continue to do it the way they've always done it because that's what humans do, right? Like we like, we like routine. Uh, we like predictability.

We don't like change, right? And so if you come in fresh eyes, fresh perspective and say, I wonder if we did this, what would happen? And you find efficiencies in the business and you can add value in that way. You can potentially increase tremendously. And it's just something that, you know, even if the entrepreneur knew that, like, even if the former business owner knew that they may just not have had the stomach or the capacity to want to do any changes.

Stephanie Hayes: 65, they're [00:39:00] 70, they're just like, I don't know, right, like, just take this off my hands. But I think in those kinds of instances, the opportunity is, um, is actually on the marketing side, because something like a laundromat, like you're kind of fixed assets, that sort of thing. But what could you do differently?

in terms of building a brand around that laundromat. Like there's one here. I just live in this little town, little tiny town. And, um, but it's kind of funky. Like it's, it's got like a funky vibe to it. And we've weirdly never had a dry cleaners here. Interesting. Yeah. And

Both: they

Stephanie Hayes: do have a laundromat. And This person bought this laundromat and made it like super fun and quirky.

And, and I, like, they have people in there all the time now. And I'm like, that was the innovation. There was not on the dryers or the like people go there because they have faster dryers or they have nicer machines. They go there because. They're, they're buying into a brand and it says something about them that they go there.

Right. And [00:40:00] this is a town full of climbers and like, you know, people who live in their tents and vans and stuff. So something like that is really well aligned with this demographic here.

Angela Gennari: I love that. That's really cool. Yeah. And you're right. Just, you know, you can take the same assets that everybody else has had and just.

Be creative with how it's, how it's put out there to, to the world. I love it. That's very cool. Yeah. So tell me about these assets. So you're talking about, you know, creating assets for a company. What assets are you, are you talking about, like, are you talking about, I mean, obviously there's contact, right?

Stephanie Hayes: It's anything in the business that, that, again, this comes from the perspective of valuation. What would be valuable to a buyer in a business? What would they value? And so there's. So far in my, in my list, there are nine types of assets, um, you know, yeah, obviously a customer list or your, you know, your, your recurring billing is one of them.

Um, I'm probably not going to get all of them as [00:41:00] I'm talking to you here, but things like, um. You know, do I have licensable IP? Like, that's a whole program I'm building right now because I've come up against this many times with my clients that I'm working with, that they've got, they've developed this IP inside their business, and they can actually turn that into a certification program or a license, something licensable, and there's a lot of leverage in doing something like that.

Um, creative assets. So a lot of people have built content who have built, um, creative assets in support of their business, but actually is really valuable to, um, if they packaged it up and curated it and turned it into something that they could sell and turned into product. Productized services are, are an asset inside your business.

Just being a service provider, this is where people get stuck, right? I'm a consultant, I'm a, I'm a whatever, um, How am I going to sell my business when I'm the one providing services? That's the big question people ask. Well, of course, you know, that's. You could maybe sell your book of business, but [00:42:00] other than that, if you have no one to develop to deliver it, then, of course, there's a bit of a problem there, but if I productize my service and I create a whole framework around the development or the delivery of that service where it's sort of in a box, that's what I'm doing right now with my business is I'm turning this into something I get like an operating system that I can deliver through a team, right?

So that becomes an asset. Then, uh, you know, obviously if I have investments in my business, that's an asset. If I, and I'm going to have to go look at my, my sheet to tell you all nine, but like, there's lots of, so first of all, there are things you can develop, but secondly there are things that you already have

Both: that

Stephanie Hayes: you're not really looking at as assets.

I have one client who, um, runs an aGennaricy and, Is really, really, really good at creating like SOPs and putting this framework in place for how their aGennaricy runs. I'm like, that would be really valuable for other aGennaricies. So she's packaged it all up and now she has this very valuable asset that [00:43:00] she can sell to other aGennaricies for them to learn.

How to run their business and how to build their business and what kind of team to put in place and who they want to hire and all of that sort of thing. So when you start looking around with that perspective, you start to uncover things inside your business and you know, I'll give you the link to the free little download if people are interested in looking at.

All those nine types of assets because I've done a little case study on each one of them so that you can kind of get that perspective. So from that perspective you're looking for what do I already have inside my business that I can leverage or what could I build inside my business that would make it more valuable.

So this is all coming from what we do valuation around and what we look for as buyers and what we look for as risks if a business doesn't have it. So that's, that's what I mean by assets is there are things that either turn into revenue long term well. Or make your business more valuable to a

Angela Gennari: buyer.

And, you know, even you can do this as a small business too, and like a really small business. My [00:44:00] son is 18 and he's getting ready to go off to college and he has had for past two years a pretty successful detailing, auto detailing business. And so, you know, we were talking like, well, what happens when you go off to college?

Like what do you do with the business? He's like, well, I guess I just shut it down. I'm like, why don't you start creating content that you can sell? And that way you get residual income because, you know, the best thing to do, if you can't do your business anymore is to teach, right? So if you can't do teach and, and so he's been creating content and he's been creating these videos, like how to do detailing and he's gotten quite a lot, a big following.

You know, and turning into a digital creator now. And so he, he actually has people on there who are like, this is really good. And he can now start charging people for these courses, you know, just putting out little videos here and there, but it's actually dramatically increased his brand because of that little, that one thing,

Stephanie Hayes: I [00:45:00] think even people who are.

in job jobs. I mean, this is the way to, it's no longer about going and getting more certifications and more skills. Like I have every fricking certification in the IT industry, right? Like at least from the perspective of the work that I did, but I think the way to bring yourself forward inside of a career is to build a personal brand for yourself inside your career, right?

So it, It's not enough anymore to just have letters after your name. We all know that just because you took a course or because you got a certification doesn't mean you're actually good at that. So building a personal brand like that, or, you know, building content or, you know, thinking about yourself as a little business is super, super valuable.

Not just in, you know, as a business owner, but You know, as a, as a, as an employee as well,

Angela Gennari: absolutely, because I mean, there are people there have been people who I know have felt really, really [00:46:00] interesting, like tick tock accounts and so forth, and they are fortune 500. HR person, but they give HR tips every day and, you know, resume tips and how to interview.

And this is brilliant. This is stuff people are looking for. They're looking for that expertise. And even if you're within a job, a nine to five job, you don't have your own company. You can definitely build a brand and using your expertise to share with others because people are seeking that information.

And just because you're kind of hidden inside this company doesn't mean that your voice doesn't matter. So, I mean, get it out there and. Go out there and show people that, you know, you can build a brand.

Stephanie Hayes: You're building a personal brand and in fact, one of, one of my nine assets is, is your brand, right?

It's your mission and your brand within your industry because that, that counts for something, especially if you have like trademarks, which I don't necessarily recommend going and doing, but if you do, you know, those are also, you know, assets that you have inside your business and make it more valuable, but your brand [00:47:00] is worth something.

Angela Gennari: Yeah, very much so. So I wanted to ask you some questions. So who inspires you?

Stephanie Hayes: My clients inspire me.

Angela Gennari: Yeah.

Stephanie Hayes: Like, the people that I'm watching sort of going through their own growth every day. Like, I'm really not, um, can I swear? I'm really not. What I would call a star fucker. Like I, you know, yeah. I'm not, not somebody who's really attracted to celebrity and because I, I, I know all these people who are quote unquote celebrities in my industry, and I've known them personally, and they're just like, they're just average people and they had a break, right?

Like they got a good break. Not saying they're not good at what they do, but they're mm-hmm . I can see that, you know, I was in a high-end mastermind once of someone's. Who's on the celebrity spectrum and what I really saw inside that mastermind was it really had nothing to do with her being good at what she did.

You got ahead [00:48:00] by the dry humping the celebrities legs, like the person who would, who would stay closest to that person. It was like a big MLM. They're all selling each other's stuff. Right. So I don't have a lot of respect for celebrity or authority or anything like that. So the inspiration I get is from my little clients sitting there going, I think I can do this.

We're having a big moment of like, I'm taking a huge leap here. I'm going to invest in this work and we're going to do it. That's my inspiration. Those are the people who get me up every day, who I'm like, I'm showing up for you because you're showing up for yourself. That's where I get my inspiration.

Angela Gennari: There's so much courage and bravery in entrepreneurialism and people just don't understand it. Like what it takes to be an entrepreneur, to start a business and to take that risk on yourself. You know, people don't bet on themselves very often. But entrepreneurs have to, and a lot of times we're scared to death, but we do it anyway.

And those are so inspiring to me. I agree with you. And the same thing [00:49:00] here, we get, we interact with a lot of celebrities and I'm the last person to even know who a celebrity is. They were, they were like, Hey, if you see a celebrity walk through the door at one of our. clients is that we get a lot of celebrities that walk through one of our, um, venues in Atlanta.

And if you see any celebrities, you have to radio in. I was like, I don't know who they are. Also, I

Stephanie Hayes: have a lot of respect for somebody who's maybe who's been able to be successful, right? Yeah. Who is, you know, but, but I don't necessarily think that they always get there because they're just like really, really extra good at what they do.

They've had a, they've. done something really well around their connections, their marketing, their whatever, and they figured it out. Good for them. I think that there's a lot of respect there, but I don't necessarily look at them and think,

Both: Oh,

Stephanie Hayes: I want to be like you. Like, what can I learn from you? What can I watch and see?

And then I get to decide if that's how I want to grow.

Angela Gennari: Absolutely. 100%. So as [00:50:00] women, we give our power away all the time, you know, whether that's just giving credit or, or not stepping into our power in a way that we should, or we could, or miss opportunity. Can you tell me about a time that you've given your power away?

Stephanie Hayes: Oh, yes. I'd encourage you to go and listen to my last podcast episode because it, it's a whole episode just on this. Really? Oh, yeah, but I grew up, uh, I mean, professionally in a male dominated environment, in a very male dominated industry. And I, you know, I was reflecting on this in a, in a writing retreat, and this is where that episode came from.

It was actually a talk that I wrote. And what I realized is that I had, um, I had spent the early part of my life. And into my, the early part of my career, being apologetic for being feminine, being apologetic for being a woman. And I remember in my early, early conditioning, I didn't want to hang out with [00:51:00] girls.

I wanted to hang out with men. I felt embarrassed to be, you know, a woman, to be a girl because I thought they were so emotional and flighty and all this sort of thing. When I got into my early career, um, I realized, I didn't realize it at the time, but I had this real like cognitive dissonance because I was leaning into the things that felt really natural for me, but I was being reprimanded all the time to the point where some, this guy that I was working with, man, that I was working for, um, said to me one day, he's like, I don't want you to talk in this meeting that we're having with our client because you don't know how to deal with clients.

I'm like, pardon. And so what I kept hearing back from these men was. You're too familiar. You're, you're, you're too, um, friendly. You're too, like, all this stuff because we'd go into these big corporate meetings with these big corporate clients and they'd be like, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

And, you know, [00:52:00] dick swinging and like, you know. Yeah,

Both: yeah.

Stephanie Hayes: And they were, it was always hard for them. It was always hard for them. Why can't we close this deal? I was the one who would go in and close deals. I was the one who would develop the relationships with the clients and they would love us like, and I could never understand why I was doing what felt natural.

But I was always being reprimanded. That's not how we do things. That's not how we do things. And then later on, and the funny thing is, is I spent the first part of my career working all with men. And then now I work almost entirely with women.

Both: And

Stephanie Hayes: it's such a, it's such a difference. And it really, I eventually had to learn that.

My femininity and my being a woman is actually my power, and I'm a type of woman that has a lot of masculine energy, but leaning into my feminine energy has made me so much more successful, and even in, I still work as a corporate consultant in the IT space, and I have stopped it. Not being who I am [00:53:00] and I still make these very strong relationships with people like the men still exist at this level kind of going, Oh, we have to like, you know, structure the contract in this way.

Don't talk to these people. I'm like, no, my superpower is talking to these people, working up and then having all of these raving fans everywhere so that the minute. We move into a new stream of work, like I'm a farmer, I get into a contract and we have, end up with years and years of work in there because we develop, I develop relationships, right?

So I gave away my power in the early part of my career. Everywhere because I thought I needed to be a man. But when, when women act like men in a business environment, they, you know, shoot themselves in the foot and they don't use the things that come naturally to them, their intuition, their compassion, their empathy.

Which actually helps with sales helps with selling tremendously longevity of clients, and I would if more women were [00:54:00] able to do that, and we're able to really lean into who they are, and that's why you find a lot of women who are running businesses now that only serve women because they. Much more naturally use their power and and their superpowers I just happen to be that person who could go in between because I I know both worlds and I'm not a people pleaser But boy, did I ever like that episode that I recorded really was a reflection on how much I had Rejected my feminine power and rejected myself as a feminine person for over half my life

Angela Gennari: That's amazing.

Yeah. And I can totally relate to that because, you know, I constantly had, especially when I came into the security industry and I now had to network with people in the security industry. And that was not my background. You know, my background was events and I'm like, where, how are they going to think of me?

It's such imposter syndrome. But, you know, I would, I realized like, I just built trust. I built that, you know, I had to show up and prove that [00:55:00] I belonged in the room every single time, whereas none of the men had to do that, you know, like they just came in. Oh, I'm from this law enforcement aGennaricy. They don't know any more about security than I do, right?

Like law enforcement and security are not the same, but I would give them more credit and everybody else would give them more credit because. It seemed to be more in alignment than what I was coming from, but yet my background was people related and that's what security is, right? It's all about trust.

It's all about being proactive. It's all about planning. And so, so much of what I did aligned well with what I was, what the security industry was, but I didn't give myself any credit for that, right? I constantly had this imposter syndrome, but one of the phrases I hate the most in this book called, um, Do business like a man, which I think is horrible because I think where I, where I really thrived is I used to have all the, you know, I have a strong masculine energy in business, right?

But I also know that there is that feminine side that builds trust, [00:56:00] that creates relationships that has this long standing, like. Ability to go in and earn their trust based on them understanding that I'm here to serve them right and to make sure that they're happy and to, you know, get to the bottom line.

The bottom line is important, but they know it's not the most important thing to me, right? That relationship is the most important that partnership, you know, saying how this women are really good at seeing how something impacts the whole thing, right? So, like, we look at the whole community, the whole company, all the employees, like, how does how does one decision impact everybody?

Okay. And we're much better at that. I'm seeing the whole picture.

Stephanie Hayes: Yeah, I would agree for sure. And I, like, I think, um, when you can show up and you can work from a place of all of your intuition, sure, we've got, you know, the work that I do in corporate, yes, there's a lot of very tactical, very,

Both: you know,

Stephanie Hayes: not intuitive work.

But when we [00:57:00] can bring that broader perspective and that, And I, you know, it's, it's even wrong to say, oh, well, the thing that women have across the board is more empathy and more intuition. No, they also are really fricking smart women who have that other side of the skills too, that are, you know, tactical, that are technical, that are incredibly intelliGennarit when it comes to all of that stuff.

You know, I just don't have

Angela Gennari: a We're great negotiators. That's the other part, is that we're really good negotiators and we're much better closers.

Stephanie Hayes: Yes, I agree. I think from a sales perspective, women are, are incredible, unless, unless, here's a caveat, unless they have gone through a male dominated sales, sales training, like, how to sell, like, I've been through those, I have learned how to sell in a very male dominated way, and those and, Women, they might get results, but people hate them, right?

Whereas the women who know how to sell through [00:58:00] intuition, trust, relationship, that's something I've always done really well is I've created relationships very, very quickly because there's just a way for us to see people. And, you know, every one of these people that sit around a table, um, you know, whether they're executives or whether they're technical people or whether they're, you know, HR, whatever, it's if you can look around that table and you can quickly ascertain what the motivation is and what the needs are for each one of those individuals.

you're winning. Because whether you're, whether you're there to deliver, whether you're there to, um, you know, push a, push a project across the finish line, solve a problem, whatever it is, that kind of intuition is so important. And I, I would argue women do that better. Absolutely.

Angela Gennari: 100 percent agree with you.

So, Stephanie, I know we're at time and this has been so enjoyable and I have just learned a ton from [00:59:00] you. I could keep talking to you for the next several hours. This has been great. But I just have one more question for you. What do you wish more people knew?

Stephanie Hayes: Oh, man. I wish more people knew that This is going to sound funny coming from me, that, um, and this is something I've just learned that has changed my life, but I wish more people knew that when we look at sort of, and I'm stealing this from one of my clients and one of my, my friends, when we look at this, the things, the, the have, the be, the do.

When we are talking about business, we spend so much time talking about what we have to do. Uh huh. When we shift that focus and we think more about who do we have to be, what do we want to have, We enter a whole new level of understanding our business and [01:00:00] understanding that our intentions drive so much more about our success than this.

I'm the person who makes the strategy. I'm the person who does the doing. But I advocate that we have to understand more about who we want to be first and align our actions to who we want to be and what we want to have.

Both: So that's been

Stephanie Hayes: new learning for me, at least in terms of like putting it that way.

And that's from Tasha Chen. I'll give her total credit to that. But I wish more people understood that because they would hold themselves back a lot less.

Angela Gennari: Yes, a hundred percent. Oh, I love that so much. That's a great way to end. Well, thank you so much, Stephanie. This has been delightful. Um, so they can find, everybody can find you on prettypowerfulpodcast.

com, but where else can they find you?

Stephanie Hayes: Probably the best place to find me is either in LinkedIn or on stephaniehays. biz is my website, which is soon going to get an overhaul and, um, probably is the best place [01:01:00] to launch off to all of the other channels.

Angela Gennari: Fantastic. Well, thank you again. This has been wonderful.

And, um, I wish you so much success and so much success to all of your entrepreneurs that you're helping, because I just love when people are out there helping small businesses. I think that that's one of the most noble things we could be doing. So thank you so much. I so appreciate you having me.

Absolutely. And everybody, we will catch you on the next episode of the pretty powerful podcast. Have a great day. Bye. Bye.

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