Episode 75: Laura Bowers

Laura Bowers - Episoode 75

Intro: [00:00:00] Welcome to the pretty powerful podcast where powerful women are interviewed every week to share real inspiring stories and incredible insight to help women or anyone break the barriers, be a part of innovation, shatter the glass ceiling and dominate to the top of their sport industry or life's mission.

Join us as we celebrate exceptional women and step into our power. And now here's your host, Angela Gennari.

Angela Gennari: My name is Angela and today I'm speaking with Laura Bowers. Laura Bowers is the CEO of the PMO boss. After 20 years of leading projects and teams, she's witnessed some of the best and worst practices out there. She then took that knowledge and developed a streamlined approach for implementing and managing a project management office.

[00:01:00] Otherwise known as a PMO using the BOSS method to help entrepreneurs get their big ideas into simple project plans. So this is an interesting topic. We don't talk to very many project managers. So I'm really excited to dive into this with you. So what got you into project management to begin with? Yeah.

And a lot of ways I fell into it. Prior to being in project management, I was doing sales work, marketing work. And then the company I was with at the time was went under. So I was kind of bouncing around and a friend was like, Hey, referral, right? The way a lot of the business world works.

So I got a referral in, I interviewed with No formal experience. But project managers are really big on soft skills. So I, the, interviewer saw that in me that I had the potential. And they brought me in with with no experience and it just clicked. I advanced really quickly through the ranks and picked everything up and then, got [00:02:00] certifications and continued down the path.

Yeah. So soft skills, meaning what, like, people management skills, any kind of people management, once you get to the point of having a team, but even just communications and relationship building, right. A lot of being a project manager I'll often joke around and say, it's your glorified secretary, or you're like a professional cat herder, right?

Like you're taking multiple personalities all up and down the leadership chain and trying to get. Things to be succinct enough for everyone to understand what's going on. And a lot of that is, is, written and spoken communication presentation skills. So yeah, a lot of, a lot of that, like, emotional intelligence type stuff.

Okay. Wow. Awesome. Okay. So you've done 20 years of projects on your own. So, I mean, excuse me with another company, correct? So you were corporate for 20 years of leading projects, and then you decided to take the leap on your own. So what did that look like? And why, why then? [00:03:00] Yeah, so I think COVID had a huge influence on me.

I was an IT program manager working for different government clients. The one I was at the last time was for eight years. So I had seen quite a bit on that, that program and it was IT, so it blew up. in COVID, right? We, talk about job security, right? Our team was heavily needed and the organization before COVID allowed remote work, but it was very like case by case and a pre COVID remote hybrid environment, which was minimal.

So we had to really equip people to work at home very quickly. So it was, it was a challenge just to keep up with that and keep the team motivated, like at a time where so much was going on in the world. And we were the ones that, we weren't necessarily like the frontline healthcare workers, but we were still going in and we were still having to like, do kind of more than, than some others at that time.

And it was stressful and you had to deal with all the health concerns at once. So it was a huge [00:04:00] challenge and I, really proud for what we were able to do and we were successful. But during that time, I just remember I had two small kids. My kids were what, two and five going into COVID. So it was just like nonstop meetings, nonstop, like potty training.

Everything was merging. It was super overwhelming. And it kind of got to a point where it's just like, is this, is this kind of it? Is this, is this what it's going to be? Just like. Kind of a grind that I'd gotten pretty familiar with at that point. Right. So I took that opportunity to dive into some self development and really look at purpose and what got me motivated.

And ultimately that, that led to taking this huge leap on, betting on myself and bringing my skills to entrepreneurs. Who may not have the skill set, right? Entrepreneurs are huge visionaries but they're not necessarily great at getting things on paper and, and sticking to a plan. That would be a lot more rewarding to go down that path.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'll, I'll say, [00:05:00] I'll, I'll be the first one to tell you. We downright suck at that. So, yeah, I will be the first one to raise my hand and say, yeah, I'm the visionary, but I need the implementation person in front of me to make it all happen. So absolutely. Okay, so, so PMO stands for project management office.

So what point do you bring in a project? Is it, is it, I know it is, when you're implementing a new software or something like that, but tell me in day to day world, like for other entrepreneurs out there, at what point should you start considering a PMO? Yeah. So this could be looked at a couple of different ways.

Like a PMO is, is certainly an enterprise level solution. So you're going to see it at all your major companies, right? They, they'll have PMOs operating but you can absolutely implement a PMO kind of at a smaller level, which is. What we kind of curate as a solopreneur, you're probably not going to need something that robust, [00:06:00] but the the templates, the processes that you put in place, the, governance that you kind of set for yourself, which these are kind of big words for a single person.

But if you put some of that in right up front. Then, as you bring in virtual assistants, VAs, as you bring in vendors, you start to have a standard and a level of professionalism that your competitors probably don't, right? And then as you hire in the PMO, the framework for the PMO is already there.

And then it just builds out. Right. So our, our method or our belief is that, start the correct processes upfront and then your expansion becomes easy. And then not even worrying about the expansion, you're so much more organized. Right from the jump. Yeah, exactly. Okay. Very cool. All right. So then you develop this thing called the boss method B O S S.

So can you explain to me what boss means and, and what, what that [00:07:00] does to your PMO? Yeah, sure. So our, our methodology is the boss framework. It basically stands for baseline outline set up and sustain. Okay. So we will go into a company and baseline where they're at. Right. See exactly what they may or may not have in place, how big their team is, what resources they have available.

And look at all that stuff. Then we kind of put together an outline of our recommendations and what what we would like to work with them through the engagement with, and what we think is the best ideas. We will curate that a little bit based on the company input and what's realistic and then from there, we're, we're going to get it set up.

Make it sustainable. So the 1 of the biggest things that is most important to us is to make sure it's sustainable. Because if we set you up with a process that you cannot keep up with, it's going to be frustrating. You end up going backwards. And I firmly believe that project management can be simple. A lot of organizations Overcomplicated, there's like 10 forms [00:08:00] for the same thing, or at least that's what it feels like.

Right. And there's ways to do this where it can be simple and sustainable to get, get you organized. All right. Wow. That's cool. All right. So, so you're starting your business and you've got two young children. So we're going to go to the mom part of this, right? Because I think moms are natural project managers, right?

Cause we, we manage a lot of different things in our lives, but how do you. Then start building a business with young children in the house, with this COVID thing going on, like, what, what does your strategy look like? Especially as somebody who is an expert in project management. Right. So, so tell me how that all played out.

Yeah, I wish I could say it was simple, even for me, but you know, that's just not the truth. I kind of laugh because like you, you say project manager and I'm like planning birthday parties right now. I'm like, my girl's birthday is this month and I'm like, Oh, that's a project, right? [00:09:00] I know. But no, I, I do find that I am hyper organized, right?

So I have a lot of I am that mom. I have like Excel spreadsheets for their birthday party. Over the years, like it sounds a little crazy, but you know, when I go to plan that next party, it's like the invite list is 95 percent done. It's everything just becomes so much simpler. Certainly helped being that I've been kind of type A about a lot of those things having those processes in place to leverage year after year.

But one thing that I have not mastered is once they kind of come home from school and putting those boundaries in place of like, mommy's still working, like, you need to, you need to leave. It doesn't make you feel terribly guilty. Yeah. But I did implement, I have a light outside my office now that's, stoplight red, I can change the colors of it.

So I will put the red light on, like, If they really can't come in and that's starting to starting to get through the [00:10:00] older one is. Is with it. The younger one still struggles, but that's actually a brilliant idea. That's such a project manager thing to do governance, right? There's government over mommy's space.

I need that. I need that for my office, for my desk, for my house. I need, I need all I needed ever. Read a stop. Don't bother me. Right. UPS guy. I mean, I need it for all of it. All of it can happen. Okay, great. So, so then you start your business. So what obstacles did you have to overcome in starting your business?

Yeah. On a practical level, one is just money, right? Just the, I had a rather nice paycheck going into this and my financial situation is changing as I'm, I'm building this business. Obviously under the pretenses that it will be way better in the future, right? No risk, no reward. So there's been some adjustments with working through finding all the funding to get this done.

Yeah. But the, I think the more mental grit of it, of just the [00:11:00] limiting self beliefs, like, is this really going to work? So many small businesses fail. And I, I really did get to a point where I just like said, screw it. Like, I would rather try and fail. And not be scared of the failure or paralyzed by the failure, which I think happens to a lot of women, to be honest and just be okay with it.

No matter how this pans out. And I think by not being scared of the failure, I've taken some of the power away from that fear. Yes. Absolutely. Which will hopefully be a great success. Yeah. And there were some things we just can't, we can't stop, right? Like we can't stop a COVID from happening, right? Like I was building a great business in 2019.

We were set to scale rapidly and then 2020 shut down my business for five months. There was nothing I could have done. Like it didn't matter how, how much I had built up at that point, COVID was going to happen. To cause a hard stop. And so, there are just some things that you just kind [00:12:00] of have to work around and say, you know what, whatever is supposed to be, my learning lesson out of this, I'm just going to take that and, and shelve it and say, okay, this was going to be, this is going to be useful for me later.

This lesson that I'm learning, that's going to come into play later. And it does, it always does. So it's like, I don't know why I'm going to need this, but I will. And then I will be like, Oh, it is a good thing that happened. Yeah. Learn. So much. And so for us, it, it made us, it forced us to develop processes that, were more efficient, and, and now it's crazy because we, we moved a lot of our training online.

We moved a lot of our onboarding and our hiring online. And before that was all in person. But, now fast forward a couple of years we're, we are rapidly expanding into other states and guess what has been the biggest help? Moving everything online. , right? And so. So now we are able to do something so much more efficiently and it would have taken us for, I mean, months to have implemented everything that we needed to implement as it [00:13:00] did during COVID.

But COVID gave us that time, COVID gave us a a cushion to be able to do that in a way that felt responsible at the time. And now it's necessary. So it has become Again, you take those lessons from COVID and, and any other major, catastrophe that you're going through in your business and you learn that, and then you just implement it later.

So. So as you're starting your business and you are, project management, you're coming from corporate, what did you find to be the biggest hurdles to come over? And then I'm not talking about obstacles like funding, but like, where, where were your skill sets where you're like, okay, yeah, this, this, this part, I don't know, because like for some entrepreneurs, it's marketing for some, it's.

Sales, like I don't know how to do sales. I don't know how to do marketing. I don't know how to do website development. Right. And so there's so many different skill sets. You have to have it on as an entrepreneur, especially as a bootstrapping entrepreneur, right? Cause entrepreneurs who are bootstrapping, [00:14:00] you kind of have to be the, You're the, you're the it department, the sales department, the marketing department, the legal department, you're everything.

So at what point did you say, I'm going to learn this? And then at what point did you say, I'm going to outsource this? Because you're a project manager, so you're probably really good at categorizing things. Yeah. So we're, we're admittingly, we're at a stage where I'd love to outsource more than what I can at the moment, right?

Like the, the ideas to be. outsourced more than not, to be honest, right? Cause I know where my skills are and they're not necessarily marketing or sales or all these other things. One thing that I think that I've done well is bring coaches in. That was one of the significant investments I decided to make as I launched was bringing in people who've walked this path before me.

Cause like, I know some stuff about sales. I've done some stuff in the past. Like I've done some things about marketing, right? But I don't necessarily know the current trends. Right. And I don't know how to do it. Like it's the best in the industry or anything [00:15:00] close to that. So I've, I have relied on some coaching to point me in the right direction or give me experts to follow.

Cause there is so much information on the internet. It can be super overwhelming and you don't really know if you're following a good source or not. So I feel like I shortcutted that process a bit by doing that. And that has helped right now. That's given me the opportunity to like fast track where I focus my learning.

But yeah, ultimately I would love to get to a point where I can outsource more of it and focus on the parts that I do well. Yeah. Well, and to your point of saying you got to figure out who you want to follow and there's so much information online, you're so So right about that, but you also have to make sure that it feels authentic to you, because like one thing that I've learned and I follow tons and tons of different experts online, online on everything from Tik TOK to YouTube to, wherever, and I'm following them because they have great advice and they're successful, but a lot of it, I don't implement.

And I, and I, it [00:16:00] just doesn't feel authentic. It's not right. It doesn't feel like my path. And some of it is just so like, there are certain People who are influencers out there and it just, they have great advice, but it's just, I always say. He's a great guy for someone else, but not me.

And so, I say that about dating and I say the same thing about about about, influencers, great advice, just not great advice for me. So, I think it has to feel authentic too. And it has to really be relevant to your business and relevant to what you're doing. Yeah, I would agree with that.

If you start, doing some TikTok dance, right, as a project manager, people, I mean, that's going to be extremely disjointed. Right, right. You've never danced in your life. Like, what are you doing? Exactly. Exactly. So, who inspires you in your journey? Yeah, I am part of the personal development road that I've been on.

I am really in that that area right now. So it's a lot of Mel Robbins. It's a lot of Tony Robbins. Lewis [00:17:00] Howes, these are podcasts that I'll listen to just to kind of keep the the mindset going. I, I know you're right on here with me, but I was listening to your podcast, preparing for this.

And some of the women you've interviewed are just incredible. I mean, they just are doing incredible things. So all that kind of stuff, I really find podcasts to be a huge source of inspiration. And some of the people that are doing them are just putting great content out. And I'm, I'm absorbing all of it.

And it's so important too, because like, for me, I, I find that I learn more over, out of somebody else's journey than I do reading text in a book. Like if I, if I just read the how to, 10 steps to be successful, that's not going to resonate as much as somebody who's telling me about their journey and how they became successful.

Like, I want to know how this is relevant and what this looks like in real life. And I want to know what somebody's looks like. And I also think that it helps. To bring it to life for you, because there are so many times where I, I read a great [00:18:00] article, but it doesn't really resonate with me, but then somebody will tell me one story about a failure that they had, and I'm like, wow, that really hit home, right?

Like that feels relevant. And so just, and also knowing that you're not alone in the struggle, because the one commonality that we all have, and this is one thing I say all the time is. Our commonality is struggle, not success, right? And so if we can figure out, okay, so they went through this, this is what happened to them.

And this is how they got out of it. That gives is going to give me more tools than 10 steps to be successful. Yeah. And I think it's really empowering to, to hear these people who are on the other side of it, because, you just see the success. You don't realize all the times that they've stumbled.

Right. And, and knowing that there were struggles along the way, it's like, It makes me feel like, Oh, I totally do have a chance, right? Like it's okay that I'm struggling and stumbling like that's, that's natural. And all these people, all these greats who've come before me are now, [00:19:00] they share that and it's, it definitely gives you a sense of that, just keep going kind of.

Just keep pushing through it. Well, and I don't know about you, but I really struggled with imposter syndrome for a long time. And I think that that's pretty common, especially with women in business is like, do I belong here? Do they take me seriously? Is this, am I making an impact? And, and so I really struggled with that, especially as I changed into the security industry, but I read one article in entrepreneur magazine.

And it was actually not even an article. It was the edit editor's letter. And Jason Pfeiffer, the editor of Entrepreneur Magazine was, was interviewing the CEO of the large umbrella company that owns like match. com and all the dating apps. And this is a billion dollar company. I mean, this guy runs a billion dollar organization.

And he was talking, Jason was talking about how he took on this role with entrepreneur magazine, and he had this great experience as an editor and other big magazines, but entrepreneur is the one where he felt the most imposter syndrome [00:20:00] because he's, he's interviewing these really powerful CEOs and entrepreneurs, and these people are so creative and they're so well resourced.

And, and he's like, I feel very. Intimidated. And the CEO of this billion dollar company says we fight. He said, even I fight with imposter syndrome every single day. And like, that was like, that was an epiphany to me. Like, wait a minute. This guy who runs a billion dollar company still has imposter syndrome.

He still feels like, am I good enough to do this? So I really kind of, opened my eyes to like, okay, you know what? This is, this is part of it, right? This is part of the growth and the struggle is that if you don't feel that, if you don't feel imposter syndrome, you're not actively working to get yourself to that place of being better.

So, so I think, I think it's actually a good thing. I think imposter syndrome will help you in the long run. Yeah, there, there's a version of me. I mean, less than 10 years ago, maybe around [00:21:00] five years ago, where I didn't think I had the skills or the things to offer, right. That my voice may not have mattered.

And everyone's said it before, right. That's a really common one. Like there's other people already doing this. And there have been some, some significant shifts in my mindset of like, there are plenty of businesses to serve, right. I do have plenty of years of experience. Like this isn't I shouldn't be selling myself short and working through those things and gaining that confidence I'm very grateful for it.

Right. Like we kind of talked about before, like these hard struggles, you learn the lessons and they, they are useful as you go on. But I've definitely gone into some rooms even recently where I'm just like, you feel like those small fish and you're just like, okay. But it's okay. I'm here.

Like, it's okay. . Yeah. Yeah, I'm here and I deserve to be here. Right. And so that's kind of what you have to remind yourself of. It's like, I could be on the outside of this room and that wouldn't really make an impact, but I'm on the inside. So yeah, there's that. So, so as you're going through, [00:22:00] you talk about in your, in your bio you talk a little bit about empathetic leadership.

Mm-Hmm. . So what is empathetic leadership and how is that relevant to what you do now? Yeah, I, I am a big believer that culture of a workplace drives success. So that is something that we work with our clients on as well, is that it's not just about processes. It's also about creating environments that people will thrive in and want to perform in.

And if you can't bring some empathy into your leadership style with your teams nobody is going to want to show up for you, right? They may punch the clock, do the job. But, they're doing something on the side. They're working their side hustle. They're not a hundred percent committed. They're looking for that next job.

They're, complaining to their coworkers on teams, right? Because there can be a lot of toxic stuff that's happening under the surface where people are literally just biding their time to, to move on. I think some of the companies that have been super successful are creating culture. They're creating people that that want to be there.

And you [00:23:00] see that with a lot of startups, right? A lot of the startup energy of like, they have a problem. They're going to solve the world. They're going to break or they're going to solve a problem. They're going to bring something to market. And it's, it's a very exciting time where people are fully invested in what they're doing.

So I'm, I'm a firm believer that as a leader, you need to bring kind of your best and create an open environment where people can communicate and Feel safe to do it. I mean, there's a term within idle methodology Which is like a, an it project management kind of certification and it's called safety culture.

And it, it feels like a slightly dramatic word for it, but it's very true, right? Creating a environment where people just feel safe, just safe to show up safe to say what's on their mind. And I have been in environments where they weren't, where it wasn't like that. Right. So once you kind of experienced the opposite you don't want to be part of that.

You're looking for. For a empathetic leader with a cool culture. [00:24:00] Yeah, yeah, well and it helps to humanize everything right because you work for a company where, you know, they, the, you feel like the leadership doesn't see you or understand you it's gonna be hard to buy into their vision, right because Like our, our company is a little unique.

We're not a customer first organization. We're an employee first organization because our employees make our company. And so if I'm constantly aligning with our clients and our employees are always wrong, client clients, right? Employees are wrong, then that's not going to build any morale. And so, For us, our employees are our organization.

So, if we can't back them, why are we even in business? And so we, we take a very opposite approach than most companies. We, we will not align with our customers, if it, if it's going to harm our employees. Yeah. And if your employees know that they're going to serve your clients so much better, right?

So it creates a circular benefit for everybody. [00:25:00] Absolutely. So when you're going into business for yourself tell me about funding and financing and travel and like, how do you manage all of that as a mom and, and as a new entrepreneur and, kind of Learning that process after having the corporate pay, now you're, now you're funding yourself and it can become expensive.

So yes, you tackle that. Yeah. It's a, it's an ongoing challenge. I, I definitely went through some stages over the summer where, where I worked through all the finances, what I could swing. I came up with, I did the numbers, right. The boring number crunching of what exactly does the business need?

What exactly do I need to, to keep moving forward. And kind of what are the points, what are the revenue goals from, from that point on the travel, I'm being pretty strategic about, I'd love to jump on a plane and be at every, conference seminar there is. But I've, I've been a little bit strategic about where we're going right now.

And then leveraging virtual, right. Leveraging [00:26:00] the tools where I can for the cost efficiencies. I've also signed up for things and then I, I'm like, okay, this isn't working, so we, we put them out of the budget pretty fast, right? When you're bootstrapping, you're a little bit more critical of like, am I really getting value out of that?

Even if it's a, I mean, honestly, a little is like a 20. Dollar service. Right. It was like, am I getting anything out of that? Yes, no. And then, you line item it out. Cause right now I, I just for transparency, I am, I'm funding this through retirement. I leveraged my 401k to, to give myself this shot.

So it's an all in, no holds bar, like betting on myself type of thing. So I'm taking that very seriously with how I kind of spend every dollar. Yeah, well, and that's, it's not unusual, especially in the climate we're in right now with banks. I mean, it's, it's very challenging to get any kind of bank funding and entrepreneurs are pulling back because they're losing their, they're losing all their stuff.

And I mean, Banks are losing it in commercial real estate [00:27:00] and investors are losing it in, in, they were over funding companies for a long time. And those companies were not being responsible with the money that they had. And, investors weren't keeping people accountable and all the, we're going to have.

Food truck Fridays and all the other perks that these companies were offering that didn't add to the bottom line. They didn't really move the needle and they were just spending money like it was never going to go away. And now we're seeing a tightening of funding everywhere. So I'm curious to, that's why I asked that question because doesn't matter how I've been in business for eight years.

We've had, a lot of success in the eight years I've talked to much, much, much bigger companies than me who have incredible success and they're having a hard time with banks and funding and, funding is just something that you always need to be doing as an entrepreneur. And so strapping has, has definitely having the bootstrapping mindset.

We'll get you a lot further than having a mindset of I need investors, right? If you're going to figure it [00:28:00] out and get gritty about it, you're going to be much more successful. Yeah, one of the things I learned early on from the coaches I mentioned is that my days need to focus on revenue generating activities, right?

So, like, you mentioned the food trucks, right? Like, there's tons of fun things that I would love to do as an entrepreneur and, work on my logo for 10 days in a row and like that kind of stuff, right? But I need to wake up every morning and just completely focus on what is going to generate revenue.

What is going to, what is actually going to build the company so that we can have. Yeah. reoccurring revenue and sustain ourselves long term. Because one thing I've learned about myself is I don't want a, a traditional nine to five job, right? And if it, if it happens, I'm okay with, with making those compromises and figuring out how this whole journey looks for me.

But it's, when you're an entrepreneur at heart, Like that's, this is what I thrive on, right? So I'm really trying to focus on what is going to bring money to the company and what is going to benefit my clients and [00:29:00] hoping that that formula is what, brings success to everybody.

Absolutely. And, and it will, it will. And that's, that's the part about, like retirement, I can sympathize with you because a lot of people say, like, I mean, there were years where I contributed zero to my retirement. Cause I'm like, I just don't have anything extra. Right. Like I think, And so, like, I'd have nothing contributing to any retirement.

I'd be pulling it out instead of putting it in. But, but I think the, entrepreneurs, your company is your retirement plan, right? So, so that's, that's The end result, right. Is that you hope to, it's kind of like, heading out and like you said, betting on yourself and, and that's a good bet.

It's a good bet because you control that a little bit. So, yeah, I love that you said that. Cause it's like, if you could just tell my mom that

dear Laura's mom. Yeah. Right. I'm not sure that she quite understands what I'm trying. I'm like, But if the company's [00:30:00] successful, I thought the retirement would be fine. That's yeah, well, and that's the hardest sell, isn't it? So the parents, so I remember when I first so my, my, at the time, my husband, I'm divorced now, but at the time he and I got married and we started a business, our very first year of marriage.

And so, we both. At first he quit his job and started the business. And then I quit my job and joined him in the business and his parents for the longest time, just kept sending us like monster ads on like, Hey, there's a job available. I'm like, we're not jobless. We're actually working like double.

We work, we work 80 hours right now. How are we going to fit in a full time job? The post office is hiring. They've great pension plans. And I'm like, Oh my God. Yeah, I get it. I get it. Yeah. So it took, it took a few years and it took, us being able to finally like, I think we took like a, we took [00:31:00] them on vacation one year and they were like, Oh, okay.

And we weren't asking them for anything, but we was, it was, it takes a long time to convince the parents that what you're doing makes any sense. I get it. And my, my mom would often say Hey, when you get a real job and I'm like, this is a real job, I actually do work really, really, really hard.

And I actually do occasionally make money. So it's okay. It's almost like a real job. I love it. I'm not, I'm not alone in that struggle. So you are not alone. You are not alone. So, so kind of going into that, talk to me about mindset. Cause you, you talk a little bit in your bio about mindset matters and how you unlock it through positive outlook.

So, entrepreneurs are by nature, very optimistic period people. So talk to me about how your mindset impacts your, your ability to keep moving. Yeah. So for me, when, as I was going through this evolution of deciding to take this jump into entrepreneurship I did a [00:32:00] leadership program. And this was before I decided to, to do this.

And I really think that that was the beginning of, of shifting my mindset from, what value do I bring to, limitless potential. But I, I joined a leadership program. It was six months. Where we met, it was like a group one on one type thing and then at the culmination of it, we actually met in Tanzania in person and climbed Mount Kilimanjaro.

That's so cool. It was remarkable, right? It was an experience. Like I'd gotten to a point in my life where like it, I felt boring. Right. Not that motherhood is boring, but it, it can be monotonous. I think we all know the truths around that. Right. Right. So it was just kind of like, Oh my God, like I'm not cool anymore.

I don't do anything cool. Like, So when this opportunity came around, it made me feel like I was exciting again, and I had something to talk about, and it was a very eye opening experience, not only just leading up to it, but doing it, actually accomplishing [00:33:00] something like that and the mindset around Saying yes to something like that.

Cause at the time, like, I didn't have money sitting around and join a six month coaching program. Like it wasn't something I was budgeting for. But I, I decided to say yes to that. And it was the beginning of really digging into my values, what I wanted out of life, what was important to me.

And then doing that big, huge adventure at the end of it, just kind of really like, solidifying that for my mind. And then from there it was like, what's next? And more, it made me feel like more was possible and that I should be dreaming bigger. And then that, ultimately led to, to, wanting to take that my professional side as well with launching a company.

So the, the mind has been really the most important part. It's, it's, It's what's controlling the decisions. Yeah. Oh yeah, for sure. So what was that like to climb Mount Kilimanjaro? That must have been just life changing. It absolutely was. [00:34:00] What I really enjoyed about the experience is one, it was like an incredible group of people that I got to, meet and do that with.

But you go with guides and porters. So they climb up the mountain with you. So you're like a little mountain family Mountain because this is a it's a week long climb. It's about five days four and a half days up two and a half down so you're pretty disconnected from technology amazingly enough there are some Cell signal on, but it's pretty limited, right?

It's not what we're used to. So it was away from computers, limited technology, just doing the climb, walking all day, talking to people, learning about the culture. The food that we actually got was incredible. So it was like, we would eat in these big giant mess tents and like all kind of break bread together.

And it was just a really. Unique opportunity as an adult in this kind of pace society that we're in where it was just slowed down so much that you could get to know people and enjoy [00:35:00] conversation while doing something like incredibly challenging. Yeah. So yeah, it was, it was life changing. So do you still keep in touch with the people that you did the climb with?

All of them. Yeah. Yeah. Isn't that interesting? Like some of those, I, I look back at some of the journeys that I've been on in life and it was the people where we had some sort of shared life changing experience or even shared trauma, like it's, those are the people that you feel most connected to, right?

Because your emotions are, are heightened and your, your awareness is heightened and you've shared something really meaningful. So I think that's incredible that you have a great network of people now who have also done something, that, that took them out of their comfort zone and, and brought them to a different place in life.

Yes, absolutely. And it's, it's opened different doors for me, right? They say like, what table are you sitting at? Right? The table I was sitting at before I decided to do something like that had, wonderful people, but just different ambitions and, and goals in life. And like, now [00:36:00] the people around me, like my circle has just gotten so much richer.

And that is another thing that, when I say life changing, it's in so many different ways. Mm hmm. Yeah, I agree. I agree. There's definitely been moments where, I've, I've had to challenge myself to get out of my comfort zone. And while I love my friends dearly and my family dearly, and, and, I would do anything for them.

They're not necessarily the people I want to go to for, Advice about certain parts of my business or, or life. And so while they might be able to give me great advice about me, like, you would like, they don't necessarily know how to get me to where I need to be in the next level of my business.

And the people that I've aligned with over the years in that, like, a CEO think tank group and, things like that, those, those are the powerful relationships that move the needle for you in your business. Yeah. Yeah. I love that. So, so tell me as women, we often give our power away. So sometimes we'll give [00:37:00] our power away and, just taking criticism when it's not due or giving somebody else credit for our work or whatever that may look like.

So can you tell me about a time when you gave your power away? And then another time when maybe you took that back and you still stood into your power? Yeah, unfortunately I can't . Yeah, I know . I know. Yeah, I was working in a pretty male dominated field. The IT sector I'm sure you can relate.

Rate security is the same. Mm-Hmm. . Yeah. And there, there had been a couple instances where I was I was the program manager, so I. The equivalent to the CIO essentially, right? For I was the leading the contractor staff and I was really the most senior person there. And there had been a couple instances where they would, tell me to take notes.

Or like just, just something like, and I, in that particular case, I looked at the person next to me and I was like, can you please take notes for me? Like, yeah, it was just almost awkward because it [00:38:00] was like the, and it was, a client situation that said that to me and I was like, I'm not like I'm in charge here, but yeah.

Got it. But yeah, there have been lots of instances. There was one in particular. I also remember the team had messed something up and, I had to go stand up and take the lashings for it, which is part of leadership. That wasn't necessarily the problem. But they did it repeatedly to me, even though I had taken responsibility.

I had, Let them know what the consequences were implemented. I, in my opinion, handled it very professionally and it just got repeated over and over again to make sure I understood it. And I'm like, I get it. Like, I don't know how many different ways to tell you. I understand this, but I had to sit there and take it.

And I, looking back, I wish I had been a little bit more aggressive or slightly more masculine energy, perhaps. In that scenario, because it was it honestly was degrading, at the end of the day. Yeah. But and then I really think the way I took my power back was by [00:39:00] moving on and having my own company and taking myself out of those situations.

Yeah. So I think that that was a, that's kind of a big power move. Oh, a hundred percent. Yeah. I agree with you. Yeah. Those are tough. It's tough when you have a, somebody who wants to talk to you, but they're talking down to you. It's like, listen, you can talk to me as a colleague, but you know, talking down to me is not going to really work.

It's not going to get you where you think you're going to go. Yeah. And, and not to belabor the point, but I am also remembering an incident where like I had explained something like I did an executive summary and then they turned to my male colleague and asked him, To explain it. Okay. I was like, So yeah, unfortunately, I can totally relate.

All right. So tell me what would you, what advice would you give to your 18 year old self? I would tell my 18 years old self that you do not have to follow the script. [00:40:00] That's that I think is a big one for me because as I was approaching, college or high school graduation, rather my town, it was like, you go to college, you get your job, you are happy about your health benefits.

And that was kind of like, it felt, it felt like when I got to that point, I wasn't making any decisions for myself. I was just doing the next steps. And I think that that really limited myself for, for a while, like years, decades, right. Until I kind of looked around and saw that there's like options that it's not all just about having a nine to five job and being happy about it.

Like I could create, I can actually create something for myself. And that didn't ever hit, like, that really didn't hit me until the last couple of years that I could create what I wanted. So, yeah, so that's what I told myself. Like, Take a minute, see what you want and create it. And I honestly, I hope that's what my daughters get to do now, right?

That's, that's kind of one of the underlying things that's fueling me is that I really hope I've created a big enough [00:41:00] umbrella for them to be able to decide what they want to do and not like just have to get a job that pays bills and that kind of stuff. Absolutely. Good for you. So how has project management what, what, what would you tell people project management does to I guess in, in real life, like, what does that look like in real life and how does project management play into, your day to day and how can we implement project management principles in our day to day life.

Yeah, so project management to me, it's, it's a lot about structure and knowing kind of what you're going to do in a situation, which is again, kind of like the, that governance decisions of like, we have this, so that goes A or B, right? When you, when you take the time to think through things ahead.

Yeah. You don't have to figure it out when you get to that crossroads. There's already kind of like a predetermined bucket and then you just have a, like maybe a Right. So I, I, I think a very, very simple application for project management is to do lists. [00:42:00] But I would highly encourage some level of prioritization.

Yeah. Like, because a to do list can run wild. I mean, I have a to do list that's, 20 years old now, right? But looking at the to do list in a much more practical way of what are the three things that have to get done today? What are the most important three things? And then kind of ignore the rest of it until those three things are done.

Right. And you absolutely can reassess day to day with what's going on. But I have found that the the list can get overwhelming if you don't put some structure or guidelines around it. And that's where I feel like the project management aspects start to help move people along. Absolutely. Yeah. I'm, I'm bad with the list because I feel like I get very few things checked off, but I just keep adding to it.

And so now I've gotten. I've gotten a little bit better. I'll start the morning by, I'll put a star next to the things that have to get done that day, and then I'll number [00:43:00] 1, 2, 3. Like, I can't start on 2 until 1 is done. So I'm interested, have you seen that help you, right, at keeping you more structured and organized and accomplishing more?

Yeah. Yeah. Because I'm a procrastinator. And so like, I will, I will look at it and I'll be like, well, I mean, yeah, I could do all my financial projections, but it would be more fun if I did this. And so, financial projections will go for like the next, six months and never get done. So I will try to do the things that I think are simple, or, I procrastinate on things that I don't want to do.

So, Yeah, there's the thought of eat the big frog first. Yeah. It's like you wake up and kind of do the most difficult thing that needs to get done for the day. Get that out of the way, the least attractive. That's another strategy that you could just do the unpleasant thing first and then.

Have time for the fun stuff in the afternoon. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I just kind of convinced myself that any of it's fun, but [00:44:00] All right, so one last question i've really enjoyed talking with you laura, I think you have so much great insight and incredible things to tell us so One last question. What do you wish more people knew?

What do I wish more people knew? I think I wish that they knew that they're capable of more, that they are capable of, of creating their version of happiness and what that looks like for them. I have found that really.

And I hope a lot more people pick up on that, right? Get, get not necessarily help, but like mentors, coaches, therapy, like whatever it looks like, like get support because it's by doing that, that you unlock. What's inside of you. Absolutely. Yeah. Sometimes It's all there. We're just afraid, right?

We're afraid to develop it. And so having somebody else there to encourage it definitely does help. You're right. The coaching definitely is a [00:45:00] impactful thing to do. Well, thank you so much, Laura. You've been just such a joy to talk to. So how can people find you? Yep. The website is the best way. It is the PMO boss.

com. There's actually a free guide up there for people that maybe hate project management, but no, they need more of it in their life. There's a guide of strategies that you could look at. But yeah, that's the easiest way to find us. Awesome. And everyone, you can always go to prettypowerfulpodcast. com and Laura Bowers will be on there as well.

And all of her links will be there. So, please check out. This episode, many more go check out Laura at PMO boss, and we really appreciate your time today. So thank you again, Laura. Yeah. Thank you so much for having me. It's been a pleasure.

Thank you for joining our guests on the pretty powerful podcast. And we hope you've gained new insight and learned [00:46:00] from exceptional women. Remember to subscribe or check out this and all episodes on prettypowerfulpodcast. com. Visit us next time, and until then, step into your own power.